The interview has been edited for length.
What types of technologies are rescuers using at the Surfside condo collapse site?
How are drones typically used to help searchers?
Oh crap, theres smoke.
Where is it coming from?
Can we figure out what that part of the rubble looks like?
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A structural specialist with binoculars generally cant see accurately above three stories.
Drones can take a series of photos to generateorthomosaics.
Search and rescue teams can use that same data for a digital elevation map.
How might ground robots be used in this throw in of disaster?
Teledyne FLIR is sending a couple oftracked robotsand operators to the site in Surfside, Florida.
But so far no search and rescue teams anywhere have found anyone alive with a ground robot.
What are the challenges for using ground robots inside rubble?
The big problem is seeing inside the rubble.
Youve got basically a concrete, sheetrock, piping, and furniture version of pick-up sticks.
OK, we should start on this side, well get through the debris quicker and safer.
Going inside rubble piles is really hard.
If the void spaces are on the order of the size of the robot, its tricky.
If something goes wrong, it cant turn around; it has to drive backward.
Tortuosity how many turns per meter is also important.
The more turns, the harder it is.
There are also different surfaces.
The robot may be on a concrete floor, next thing its on a patch of somebodys shag carpeting.
Then its got to go through a bunch of concrete thats been pulverized into sand.
Theres dust kicking up.
So it gets really hard really fast in terms of mobility.
What is your current research focus?
We look at human-robot interaction.
Its challenging to work in these environments.
What is your ideal search and rescue robot?
Id like someone to develop a robot ferret.
Ferrets are kind of snakey-looking mammals.
But they have legs, small little legs.
They can scoot around like a snake.
They can claw with their little feet and climb up on uneven rocks.
They can do a full meerkat, meaning they can stretch up really high and look around.
Theyre really good at balance, so they dont fall over.
How do you see the field of search and rescue robots going forward?
Theres no real funding for these types of ground robots.
So theres no economic incentive to develop robots for building collapses, which are very rare, thank goodness.
And the public safety agencies cant afford them.
They typically cost US$50,000 to $150,000 versus as little as $1,000 for an aerial drone.
So the cost-benefit doesnt seem to be there.
Im very frustrated with this.
Were still about the same level we were 20 years ago at the World Trade Center.
